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Jewish Converts to Christianity. A list.
02-02-2015, 06:36 AM
Post: #46
RE: Jewish Converts to Christianity. A list.
If he's a troll, it's quite the act, and I doubt most Jews would be laughing.
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02-02-2015, 06:37 AM
Post: #47
RE: Jewish Converts to Christianity. A list.
(02-02-2015 06:33 AM)BRIC Countries Wrote:  
(02-02-2015 05:33 AM)EVILYOSHIDA Wrote:  If jesus was jewish and the original followers of jesus were jewish, then I don't see the contradiction. I think they are just not identifying with the talmudic judaism.

Also I think it's possible to identify with the culture/ethnicity but religious identifying with Christ.

It doesn't matter what you or I think; it's what Jews think.

yeah but jews are all over the place with their thoughts. They straddle race, religion and nation.

I actually think jews for jesus are coherent:

Quote:Alister McGrath, former Professor of Historical Theology at Oxford University, claims that the 1st century "Jewish Christians" were totally faithful religious Jews. They differed from other contemporary Jews only in their acceptance of Jesus as the Messiah

Those who know, know! Big Grin
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02-02-2015, 06:48 AM (This post was last modified: 02-02-2015 06:51 AM by Rako.)
Post: #48
RE: Jewish Converts to Christianity. A list.
Karl Marx
Srul Moiseevich Blank, Lenin's grandfather
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02-02-2015, 06:52 AM
Post: #49
RE: Jewish Converts to Christianity. A list.
Karl Marx became an atheist. I'm trying to focus on the ones that accepted Christ until the end.
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02-02-2015, 06:55 AM
Post: #50
RE: Jewish Converts to Christianity. A list.
(02-02-2015 05:44 AM)EVILYOSHIDA Wrote:  Black glove - Christian Cross.

[Image: hqdefault.jpg]

white and black gloves are very fishy. symmetrical cross is fishy too. dude goes over the top with anti-jewish trolling too. he makes fun of gentiles too.
Who is the person on the right in the photo?

You realize "Br." Kaplan is not wearing a real monk's habit?
I dont know what the pink things are for either on his belt.
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02-02-2015, 06:56 AM
Post: #51
RE: Jewish Converts to Christianity. A list.
I think that's Michael Collins Piper. not sure though.
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02-02-2015, 06:57 AM
Post: #52
RE: Jewish Converts to Christianity. A list.
(02-02-2015 06:52 AM)EVILYOSHIDA Wrote:  Karl Marx became an atheist. I'm trying to focus on the ones that accepted Christ until the end.
He might not have really stayed an atheist, although that was the official line in the USSR, and he did write things sometimes to that effect.
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02-02-2015, 06:59 AM
Post: #53
RE: Jewish Converts to Christianity. A list.
there are indications that he was luciferian or satanic. some poems he wrote talk about this.

Satanism is the worship of Science/Technology.
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02-02-2015, 07:06 AM
Post: #54
RE: Jewish Converts to Christianity. A list.


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02-02-2015, 07:24 AM
Post: #55
RE: Jewish Converts to Christianity. A list.


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02-02-2015, 08:14 AM
Post: #56
RE: Jewish Converts to Christianity. A list.
(02-02-2015 04:24 AM)EVILYOSHIDA Wrote:  you can definitely be JEWISH and CHRISTIAN at the same time.

can you be a jewish atheist? yep.

So why can't you be a jewish christian?

Belief in the divinity of Christ is the theological line most Jews believe they cannot cross.

Perhaps Jews could also be Unitarian Christians, although some might object and put quotation remarks around Christians here.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unitarianism

"Unitarianism is a Christian theological movement named for the affirmation that God is one person, in direct contrast to Trinitarianism, which defines God as three persons coexisting consubstantially in one being. Unitarians maintain that Jesus of Nazareth is in some sense the "son" of God but that he is not the one God himself. Though they may believe that he was inspired by God in his moral teachings, all Unitarians perceive Christ as human, rather than divine."
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02-02-2015, 08:16 AM
Post: #57
RE: Jewish Converts to Christianity. A list.
In studying Jewish converts to Christianity, it would be interesting to see what religion, if any, was practiced by the children and grandchildren of these converts.
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02-02-2015, 08:24 AM
Post: #58
RE: Jewish Converts to Christianity. A list.
By the way, although it is a minority opinion, one rabbinical scholar believes the Apostle Paul was a goy, not a converted Jew.

http://www.theseekerbooks.com/articles/mythmaker.htm

"Most Christians think of the "early Christians" as one group, the followers of Jesus who stayed together after the crucifixion. Believing Jesus had risen from the dead, then ascended to heaven, they awaited his return and spread his message. These followers included the original apostles, minus Judas who had hanged himself, and they were led by Jesus' brother, James. And then there was Paul, a man who had never met Jesus but had experienced a vision that brought him into the fold. Whatever happened to him as he traveled the road to Damascus convinced him that Jesus really had conquered death. Paul joined the group at Jerusalem and declared himself "apostle to the gentiles."

Who was this Paul? Was he a Jew, a Pharisee who has persecuted the followers of Jesus, then later became the greatest advocate of Christian ideas? That is the conventional view of him, largely supported by the Bible, but it is not the view presented in The Mythmaker. Hyam Maccoby lives up to his name (the Maccabees of the Bible were hereditary High Priests who rebelled against Roman rule) and refuses to accept the status quo. He says the poor Pharisees have been given a bum rap, that far from being the hypocrites Christians believe them to be, they were actually very flexible and tolerant in their beliefs, and maintained dialogs on every subject, always examining new points of view. In fact, Maccoby tells us that most likely Jesus was himself a Pharisee. He says Jesus' teachings were identical to the Pharisee teachings, while Paul falls far short of the elegant logic and extensive knowledge required of a Pharisee.

We learn in this book that it was the Saducees who were stooges of the Romans. They were connected to the High Priest who was selected by the Romans. Maccoby's theory is that Paul, before his so-called conversion, was working for the High Priest who would have been trying to stamp out the Jesus movement because it was a threat to Rome. In Maccoby's view, Jesus was a political agitator who adhered to the Jewish idea of the messiah as one who would deliver the Jews from political (not spiritual) bondage. Maccoby says Jesus was just one more failed messiah. His death on the cross basically ended his movement. Except for one thing. His followers believed they had seen him alive after he'd been placed in a tomb. Because of this, they continued to believe he was the messiah. Maccoby does not offer an explanation of how Jesus could have been seen alive; he does not deal with the difficult -- and crucial -- question of whether Jesus actually rose from the dead. But the implications of the situation he describes have nothing to do with founding a new religion. Jesus and his followers were Jews who were looking for an earthly delivery from hundreds of years of subjugation by the brutality of Rome.

So, if that is the case, how did the Christian religion get started? Enter Paul, with his vision and his guilt for having persecuted the disciples of Jesus. Paul never shared the same idea of the Jesus movement as the Jerusalem apostles who had actually known Jesus. Paul instead devised his own version of Jesus, based largely on existing pagan religions. Under Paul's teaching, Jesus became the son of God, the suffering savior who died to redeem the rest of us. This was not a new idea, but borrows from older religions like Zoroastrianism, and also takes on some of the flavor of the mystery cults of the day. In the idea of eating the flesh and drinking the blood of the savior, a kind of "magic" that became the eucharist that gives us instant salvation based only on faith, Paul roams a long way from traditional Jewish ideas. The eucharist is a basically pagan form of ritual, a practice that learned Jewish scholars of the time would have abhorred.

Paul's ideas were not Jewish ideas, but Jesus was a loyal Jew, always faithful to the Torah. Maccoby suspects that Paul was no Jew, but had converted to Judaism and tried to become a scholar like the Pharisees but could not make the grade. The simple ideas of the Christianity he invented gave him the power and prestige he craved. "
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02-02-2015, 10:46 AM
Post: #59
RE: Jewish Converts to Christianity. A list.
(02-02-2015 08:16 AM)Roland Bates Wrote:  In studying Jewish converts to Christianity, it would be interesting to see what religion, if any, was practiced by the children and grandchildren of these converts.

I believe Israel Zoller's children are still Christians.

Often times the most ardent believers in Catholicism were converted jews

Jews for Jesus people are called 'inverted marranos' Jewish on the outside, Christian on the inside.

Those who know, know! Big Grin
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02-02-2015, 10:55 AM
Post: #60
RE: Jewish Converts to Christianity. A list.
I guess I'm just confused as to why Jewish leaders have an issue with removing Jews who believe in Jesus as the Messiah from identifying themselves as people of Jewish heritage.

But, at the same time, have no problem with accepting the scores of Jewish people who identify themselves as Agnostics and Atheists as part of the authentic Jewish community.

What gives?

How come believing in Jesus makes a Jew not a Jew?

But being a Jew who doesn't believe in God at all is perfectly fine?

I guess I don't understand.

"If you don't love all, you love no one" - Reverend Jesse Lee Peterson
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