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Some Olde Tyme NHB
07-12-2017, 10:08 AM
Post: #16
RE: Some Olde Tyme NHB
(07-12-2017 03:26 AM)CTsar Wrote:  
(07-11-2017 01:55 PM)Megatherium Wrote:  *I think this one was the second event I ever saw. Penthouse Pet ring girls courtesy Battlecade owner Bob Guccione.

This promotion had better talent, strong matchmaking and an overall higher level of competition than UFC at the time. It introduced such innovations as the five minute round, mandatory gloves, numerous weight classes and competitive even matchups to North America. Match maker John Perrettti moved over to UFC when it folded in time for UFC Japan , 16, 17, Brazil and 18; their competitive peak imo before Pride started poaching their roster just days ahead of UFC 19. They had been removed from US cable and could do nothing to stem the bleeding. Interesting times.








I think he wanted strikers to dominated the UFC. When he setup that Heavyweight tournament strikers started winning a lot of bs decisions over grapplers. Bas vs Randleman, Rizzo over Coleman, etc. They hired Bas and immediately made him the face of the org, even changed the UFC logo to better resemble him, then Bas retired like 2 fights later lol. Good times. its amazing how the UFC managed to survive the blackout years.

He made no bones about his preference for strikers in Battlecade. Mo Smith's tko of Conan was really huge for strikers at EF 3. Good point about the Bas and Rizzo decisions, I had never put that together but I'm sure you're right. UFC 18 was huge for me not only because it was stacked but it was the first event back on cable ppv up here in Canada. Interestingly Steven Quadros had Bas ranked #5 in his heavyweight top ten rankings in Black Belt magazine, later they wound up working together calling fights for Pride. I wonder if the merits of those ratings were ever discussed off camera?

Our blackout was a total one including cable and satellite that both began and ended before yours. The video of EF 2 I posted where they arrested everyone on the Indian reserve outside of Canada; that was what prompted the Canadian ban and it lasted from early 1996 until late 1998.You were lucky they didn't go after satellite providers too or UFC would have surely died.

I got around this problem myself by setting up Dish Network at a relative's cottage in Birch Bay Wa just across the border, before that I was going to Kiniski's Reef in Point Roberts WA to watch the ppvs in the tavern there. Dedication!

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07-12-2017, 11:39 AM
Post: #17
RE: Some Olde Tyme NHB
(07-12-2017 10:08 AM)Megatherium Wrote:  
(07-12-2017 03:26 AM)CTsar Wrote:  
(07-11-2017 01:55 PM)Megatherium Wrote:  *I think this one was the second event I ever saw. Penthouse Pet ring girls courtesy Battlecade owner Bob Guccione.

This promotion had better talent, strong matchmaking and an overall higher level of competition than UFC at the time. It introduced such innovations as the five minute round, mandatory gloves, numerous weight classes and competitive even matchups to North America. Match maker John Perrettti moved over to UFC when it folded in time for UFC Japan , 16, 17, Brazil and 18; their competitive peak imo before Pride started poaching their roster just days ahead of UFC 19. They had been removed from US cable and could do nothing to stem the bleeding. Interesting times.








I think he wanted strikers to dominated the UFC. When he setup that Heavyweight tournament strikers started winning a lot of bs decisions over grapplers. Bas vs Randleman, Rizzo over Coleman, etc. They hired Bas and immediately made him the face of the org, even changed the UFC logo to better resemble him, then Bas retired like 2 fights later lol. Good times. its amazing how the UFC managed to survive the blackout years.

He made no bones about his preference for strikers in Battlecade. Mo Smith's tko of Conan was really huge for strikers at EF 3. Good point about the Bas and Rizzo decisions, I had never put that together but I'm sure you're right. UFC 18 was huge for me not only because it was stacked but it was the first event back on cable ppv up here in Canada. Interestingly Steven Quadros had Bas ranked #5 in his heavyweight top ten rankings in Black Belt magazine, later they wound up working together calling fights for Pride. I wonder if the merits of those ratings were ever discussed off camera?

Our blackout was a total one including cable and satellite that both began and ended before yours. The video of EF 2 I posted where they arrested everyone on the Indian reserve outside of Canada; that was what prompted the Canadian ban and it lasted from early 1996 until late 1998.You were lucky they didn't go after satellite providers too or UFC would have surely died.

I got around this problem myself by setting up Dish Network at a relative's cottage in Birch Bay Wa just across the border, before that I was going to Kiniski's Reef in Point Roberts WA to watch the ppvs in the tavern there. Dedication!

that show was huge for me too because it was Rutten's UFC debut. I didn't have access to Pancrase tapes in those days, but the UFC had produced a highlight heel in one of the earlier shows with Bas front kicking Frank Shamrock in the face and beating the crap out of Mo Smith, so I was hyped as shit for his debut. He was initially scheduled to fight Randy Couture for the HW belt at UFC Brazil, but at the last minute Randy signed with Shooto for their NYE show (and was armbarred by Enson). So his debut was postponed to UFC 18. Then it finally happened, and for months the only info that I had about it was a small update on seg.com that read "Bas Rutten wins... more info coming soon". Big Grin
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07-12-2017, 12:18 PM
Post: #18
RE: Some Olde Tyme NHB
(07-12-2017 11:39 AM)CTsar Wrote:  
(07-12-2017 10:08 AM)Megatherium Wrote:  
(07-12-2017 03:26 AM)CTsar Wrote:  
(07-11-2017 01:55 PM)Megatherium Wrote:  *I think this one was the second event I ever saw. Penthouse Pet ring girls courtesy Battlecade owner Bob Guccione.

This promotion had better talent, strong matchmaking and an overall higher level of competition than UFC at the time. It introduced such innovations as the five minute round, mandatory gloves, numerous weight classes and competitive even matchups to North America. Match maker John Perrettti moved over to UFC when it folded in time for UFC Japan , 16, 17, Brazil and 18; their competitive peak imo before Pride started poaching their roster just days ahead of UFC 19. They had been removed from US cable and could do nothing to stem the bleeding. Interesting times.








I think he wanted strikers to dominated the UFC. When he setup that Heavyweight tournament strikers started winning a lot of bs decisions over grapplers. Bas vs Randleman, Rizzo over Coleman, etc. They hired Bas and immediately made him the face of the org, even changed the UFC logo to better resemble him, then Bas retired like 2 fights later lol. Good times. its amazing how the UFC managed to survive the blackout years.

He made no bones about his preference for strikers in Battlecade. Mo Smith's tko of Conan was really huge for strikers at EF 3. Good point about the Bas and Rizzo decisions, I had never put that together but I'm sure you're right. UFC 18 was huge for me not only because it was stacked but it was the first event back on cable ppv up here in Canada. Interestingly Steven Quadros had Bas ranked #5 in his heavyweight top ten rankings in Black Belt magazine, later they wound up working together calling fights for Pride. I wonder if the merits of those ratings were ever discussed off camera?

Our blackout was a total one including cable and satellite that both began and ended before yours. The video of EF 2 I posted where they arrested everyone on the Indian reserve outside of Canada; that was what prompted the Canadian ban and it lasted from early 1996 until late 1998.You were lucky they didn't go after satellite providers too or UFC would have surely died.

I got around this problem myself by setting up Dish Network at a relative's cottage in Birch Bay Wa just across the border, before that I was going to Kiniski's Reef in Point Roberts WA to watch the ppvs in the tavern there. Dedication!

that show was huge for me too because it was Rutten's UFC debut. I didn't have access to Pancrase tapes in those days, but the UFC had produced a highlight heel in one of the earlier shows with Bas front kicking Frank Shamrock in the face and beating the crap out of Mo Smith, so I was hyped as shit for his debut. He was initially scheduled to fight Randy Couture for the HW belt at UFC Brazil, but at the last minute Randy signed with Shooto for their NYE show (and was armbarred by Enson). So his debut was postponed to UFC 18. Then it finally happened, and for months the only info that I had about it was a small update on seg.com that read "Bas Rutten wins... more info coming soon". Big Grin

Right, the Couture signing was in late 98 and preceded the exodus prior to UFC 19. Of course the Couture defection set up the heavyweight Road to the Title' tournament. I believe 18 was also the first event that did not feature a tournament format. All single fights. Belfort was actually advertised on cable ads as fighting Tito at UFC 19 and Pride poached him right before the event. They scrambled around and came up with a Guy Mezger rematch in it's place and called the event Young Guns because of all the nobody's on the card. UFC cards sucked after that until Zuffa took over with the exception of 22 I think it was that had Tito vs Frank Shamrock. The very boring Tito Ortiz had become their poster boy. Frank Shamrock did commentary because they couldn't afford to pay him to fight anymore, it was quite sad.

Actually Mark Kerr was the first defector to Pride unless you include Igor Vovchanchyn who apparently signed but never fought due to injury rumor has,.

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07-12-2017, 03:51 PM
Post: #19
RE: Some Olde Tyme NHB
even before the cable ban, some of their main fighters were defecting to pro wrestling orgs. Don Frye went to New Japan, Ken to WWF , Tank to WCW. Then Pride kept poaching their top fighters one by one, leaving then only with Tito and Miletich on the roster lol. Their cards kept getting worse and culminated with UFC 24 being their worst PPV card of all time.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UFC_24


thank God that PRIDE was around at the time.
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07-12-2017, 05:10 PM
Post: #20
RE: Some Olde Tyme NHB
money talked.. Pride was paying people the most moolah
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07-12-2017, 07:19 PM
Post: #21
RE: Some Olde Tyme NHB
(07-12-2017 03:51 PM)CTsar Wrote:  even before the cable ban, some of their main fighters were defecting to pro wrestling orgs. Don Frye went to New Japan, Ken to WWF , Tank to WCW. Then Pride kept poaching their top fighters one by one, leaving then only with Tito and Miletich on the roster lol. Their cards kept getting worse and culminated with UFC 24 being their worst PPV card of all time.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UFC_24


thank God that PRIDE was around at the time.

Tito and Miletich lol. Two of the most boring fighters in mma. The owners really liked Miletich for some reason. He gave the usually exciting Mikey Burnett a wedgie for 15 minutes down in Brazil and somehow still got the decision and they refused to do a rematch. And Miletich always defended his belt against guys outside the top ten. He did fight top ten guys outside the UFC during his run a few times and lost every time while maintaining his UFC belt. These losses included fights with Jitaro Nakao, the #2 in Shooto behind Sakarai, at Superbrawl, Pele Landi at WEC 8 which I posted above (classic event) and Kiyoshi Tamura at Rings. And he kept his UFC belt all along mind you.

Zuffa put an end to this in short order when they took over, matching him against the world class Carlos Newton the first chance they got and then forcing him to fight at 185 after that. Newton was supposed to fight Anderson Silva at UFC 34 but Rudimar Federico pulled him from UFC after UFC told them the Pele/Menne rematch was off because Pele had lost that summer to the big Dagestani at the Kuwait 8 man ww/mw superstar tourney that Dave Menne won and Gil Castillo was given the spot. I believe Newton was the only fighter that was somehow allowed to fight in both UFC and Pride; no idea why. The first Pele/Menne fight was at WEC 9 which I posted here on the previous page. I don't think Pele was ever quite the same fighter after the beating at the hands of the much bigger Caucasus Muslim fighter, I think his name was Karaev. Menne said the Kuwaitis didn't make the Muslim make the weight. Of course Pride booked the Anderson Silva/Newton fight and Matt Hughes took Ando's spot vs Newton at UFC 34 and the famous choke out/slam ko ending happened which was later copied by WWF and the Matt Hughes era was born. I was already a big Anderson Silva fan by this time. Good days.

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07-12-2017, 07:40 PM
Post: #22
RE: Some Olde Tyme NHB
Tom's Video on 16th in North Van had Shooto, Pancrase and Rings tapes too. A lot of obscure US events as well as many vale tudos from Brazil and some Russian shows, K1 too. That was nice.

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07-14-2017, 06:48 AM
Post: #23
RE: Some Olde Tyme NHB
Kareem Barkelaev iirc. Dave Menne won the Kuwait tournament and Coleman won Pride Gp 2000 that same year. That would be the last time that Wrestlers would dominate MMA in a while, until the UFC became the top org again in '07.
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07-14-2017, 03:19 PM
Post: #24
RE: Some Olde Tyme NHB
this fight was interesting.. Wand did not want to trade with Tamura in the 2nd round. preferring to take him down.



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07-14-2017, 03:38 PM
Post: #25
RE: Some Olde Tyme NHB
^that's prime Wand. From the first Hendo fight to the Hunt fight he was at his absolute best. He declined steadily after fighting Hunt.
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07-14-2017, 04:13 PM
Post: #26
RE: Some Olde Tyme NHB
^ good analysis. I agree the beginning of the end was his fight with Hunt.

he was in top form when he fought all these japanese guys.

they fed his spirit in a way and made him stronger. it was truly frightening to watch.

Tamura at least put up a great fight though
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07-14-2017, 08:23 PM
Post: #27
RE: Some Olde Tyme NHB
Tamura was one of the most underrated fighters in history. Was one of the top 170/185ers in his day but fought a lot of bigger guys. Beat the UFC champ while he was champ in Rings.

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07-15-2017, 02:01 AM
Post: #28
RE: Some Olde Tyme NHB
I agree. he's one of the all time greats.

realistically he was a WW but fought anyone anytime.

Very good record if you examine it in retrospect and he was never truly that washed up.

he ended his career with a win over his arch enemy Sakuraba.
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